The end of a thread and incessant questioning... Choose Love for all, as all souls are connected

For Anyone reading (and if you will, you can answer):

How do You view non-duality and how do you view duality?

Which one of these do you think is the truth or do you think they are both true or neither is true?

What other (related or non related to this subject) views you have regarding Existance, if you want to share?

Thank You.


My current take/view:

I’ll start with the obvious/disclaimer, and that is that I do not know how things actually work or how they actually are, I only have an appreciation of how they are, obviously limited, due to me having limitations, both in perception and in other capacities, thus my views are, well, limited, but even if they are limited in scope, they might still be true, at the very least true for me.

I think that both duality and non-duality can be both correct and incorrect, depending on definitions, points of view, knowledge and understanding that one has, experiences, the ability to perceive, clarity, etc.

We can barely define an individual, since we also have concepts like Soul, Spirit, Essence, Higher Self, Energy, Memory, Reincarnation, Identity and also Different Philosophical Views on what is an individual, etc.

Anyway, without dwelving too much into definitions, I would like to present my understanding and views.

I do not have a strong view on either of these concepts (duality or non-duality) yet I understand them, at least somehow/partially.

Ok…

Using the internet and Artificial Intelligence, I get these two simple definitions: “Duality is the perception of reality as separate and distinct parts, while non-duality recognizes that everything is a seamless, interconnected whole”.

Also “Duality is characterized by concepts like ‘two’, ‘self and other’, or ‘good and evil’, and often leads to feelings of separation and conflict. Non-duality, conversely, sees these divisions as an illusion and emphasizes that everything arises from the sane source, leading to a feeling of oneness and interconnectedness”.

Ok…
I Agree with these definitions, but not entirely, in the sense that (for example) duality doesn’t necessarily leads to conflict, but has the potential to lead to conflict, between different parties, parts, opposites, wether persons, ideas, structures, etc.

Another OK…
Analyzing from the P. O. V. of non duality, let’s go with the view that “everything arises from the same source”; does that automatically imply that all things are one, literally one entity or one consciousness?
In a way, yes, but not necessarily in an absolute way.

Just because everything arises from the sane source, it doesn’t mean that all parts are one, they just have a common origin.

On the other hand, the simple fact that there is a connection between them, could imply that they are still the same, just different branches of the same tree, to give such an analogy.

If you go with the Hindu Advaita view/Concept, you get that reality is ultimately one, that Atman (individual soul) is identical to Brahman (supreme reality).

Yes, judging from that point of view, you and the Creator (to use such a word for the Source of all) are One And The Same.

Still, without going into too many details, I know that there are philosophical currents in Hinduism which are not fully Advaita, nor Dvaita, and which posit that there is a level of separation between the different parts of the Whole, even though they are technically one Being (or one body).

Of course, the separation might exist thanks to the limited point of view/perception of each part of the whole (or at least some parts, which view themselves separate; although I would argue that perhaps all parts, all incarnations of the whole feel a certain level of separation).

Now, if we see things from a Christian or Muslim or Jewish perspective, things usually take a dual approach.
I would argue that fir the most part, Western Society as a whole has been mostly dyalistuc, even in the pre-Chrustian Era(s), during the heyday of Hellenism, for example, when God’s were viewed as Unique, Separate Beings.

Of course, I have not dwelved deep enough into Mysticism from either one of the Abrahamic Faiths, nor really know, in depth, what views did/do Gnostics have, and especially, I have even less knowledge regarding the Gods the populations surrounding the Mediterranean Sea and beyond worshipped.

There could have been instances or similarity with Advaita or at least a kindred concept.

A interfering theological aspect is The Thrinity, as viewed from the Christian side, since it’s an interesting approach and view regarding the Divine; all I know is that these things are considered Mysteries by the Christian Cults, in the sense that they are beyond mere mortal understanding.
The Father, The Son and The Holy Ghost are seen as One Being, in essence, but also Three Distinct and Eternal Persons.

As a side-note, I have seen some individuals (Pastors, Rabbis, etc.) on YouTube saying that Christianity borrowed a lot from older cults, thus even their ideas on God and Divinity are borrowed concepts or at least, merged concepts.

Another thing is that in Christianity each human being is a Unique Individual, a Unique Soul, Created by God; even though God is Everywhere and in all Creation, He is beyond creation too, not identified with it; thus, to simplify things, Christianity has a dualistic approach, although, of course there are other and perhaps even more appropriate terms for how Christians see the World, Reality and God/Divinity.

I would add that there is a concept of Energy in Christianity too, although it is created by God and not one with Him; I’m talking about Grace (as a concept - viewed especially from an Orthodox but probably Catholic P. o. v. too); it is a gift which is added to the created soul and it is a quality through which a person becomes a Saint (if certain criteria are met), which is the goal of the process called Salvation (view/research Theosis/Deification).

OK…
Back to Duality and non-duality…

I have seen an interesting video about Itzhak Bentov once, where he explained how he views spirituality, and he was talking about our relationship/relation with the Divine, how things are on a higher realm, judging from a higher view, the nature of our souls/us, etc., which made me think about this idea thst maybe we are separate beings, possibly having separate origins or with no origin at all (in the sense that we are eternal beings, not created - also, something akin to how the ancient Greeks viewed their Gods).

Maybe there is no Source or maybe there are countless multiple sources for existance, and maybe these sources were made by each one of us or by us, as a collective.

Also, there is the possibility that the multitude (us) created the Whole, even God or the Source, as a Supreme Egregore, representing our collective will and power, and that was a starting point of us living in a union, as one, yet being eternally different too (although in this theory or rather concept/idea, I think being or becoming one with the Supreme Eggregore is fine too, since technically, for omnipotent beings, time and space are toys).

Yeah, you can view it as fantasy, but at least give it a thought.

Anyway, I do not necessarily believe that, nor condone it, nor do I necessarily claim it as my idea, but I can say that it came to me, in my thoughts, the concept, and not now, but quite a while ago.

Of course, if you were to view things from another perspective, maybe the Supreme Eggregore also existed in us, until we manifested or created Him/It/Her.

In this imaginative exercise/view, the role of that being was and is to facilitate our Evolution and It’s Evolution too, linking all of us and helping us have a common will, although perhaps a changing common will, something like a morphic field, where the settings of our collective creation are being changed all the time, although probably there are settings which still bind us all to the whole.

Anyway, the last part was/is just an exercise of my imagination and my thinking, I do not claim it as anything else, but it could actually be a or the truth, who knows.

Also, it (this theory of mine) transcend our Science, so maybe there can never be proof or maybe there is, for such an hypothesis.
It doesn’t deny a common origin of our Universe, if that’s the most accepted model of contemporary Science, it just says that, above all, beyond time and space, originally all that it is, or rather all beings, co-created an Ultimate Source, in order to fasten our evolution, both as individuals and as one being, which we already are (through that Ultimate Union/Creation and Supreme Eggregore of all of us).

The thing is, I am not confined by views, ideas, notions, absolutisms of any kind, dogmas, etc., so, yeah, I’m flexible as I can possibly be, thus I’ll always search for more and for a higher meaning, higher understanding and higher purpose.

Well, don’t mind those last phrases if you don’t like them.

I treat almost anything as theoretically, above all.

Heck, even the brain in a jar or solipsism cannot be denied, because each argument you give against it, can be circumvented and used for it, so, for me, Spirituality and Existence and Experiences are all, above all, probabilities.

Still, I always take the chance thst it is all real, regardless of hidden or higher truths, since I would rather behave well with creations of my imagination, then risk doing any harm to a real being.

Plus, it’s more fun to think that it’s all real, we are all real, etc., and not just dome data in a extremely advanced “computer” or “brain” or (hive?) “mind” or whatever.

Everything and everyone evolves better through such a leap of faith, believing in what our senses and our brain (or what we perceive as our senses and our brain) dictate is “out there” and “real”.

Well, actually, Spirituality, for me, above all, even above ideas, is about Living and about Experiences and about The Journey, thus beliefs, ideas, concepts, become just secondary, at best, in importance.

I do not know anything, I do not claim anything, I just take life as it is, how it presents itself to me, and I try to make it better, for me, my dear ones and others, hopefully for the whole too.

So, as a conclusion, please leave your view on duality, non duality and anything you want - if you want, of course.

Reality is whatever we accept as real, at least from a subjective p.o.v.

Live (Your) Reality on Your Own Terms. :blush:

All The Best to Everyone. :pray::heart:

(From a Highly Flexible Person)

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Religion, Spirituality, Divinity, Samsara: weapons of control and submission inside a Matrix?

What if Spirituality was or is, ultimately, a lie?

We can imagine countless scenarios, but for now I’ll only lay the groundworks for a new hypothetical series… of questions: Spirituality is ultimately a lie.

Love, submission, adoration, renunciation, abstinence, peace, non violence…

Those could all be used as manipulations by some hostile beings or intelligentia or at least let’s say by someome or something else…

If you would want to create a perfect prison system or containment system or the perfect slavery system, perhaps you don’t need to look further anymore, it already exists and it’s what we call fundamentally the higher or noble truths, higher ways of being, higher knowledge, a better way to be…

What if these are all… Wrong?!

If a hostile or simply another power were to enslave humanity, and if that power were to be Aeons ahead in terms of tech, Spirituality and Religion and the control of thoughts and human souls, including after death, would be or could be the top priorities in a master plan to keep humanity… obedient.

Gods, Scriptures, Mysticism, Revelations, Magick, Countless apparent Spiritual Worlds, Judgements, Hells, Heavens, In-between Worlds, Punishments, Karma, Righteousness, Weakedness… Those would be primary concepts used to mindwash souls inside a large, incredibly large… system.

Recyclement, Resource Management, and many other things would be the key words.

The reward for the most noble of souls?
Exiting the system, presumably…
Or rather joining the controllers.

If you’d have unlimited tech, extremely advanced, like order of magnitude, thousands or millions above ours, you could easily fool a primitive species, you could easily use them as resources, possibly for an extremely long time or potentially even… forever.

THAT might actually be the ultimate truth behind spirituality: controlled systems, souls used as the ultimate prize or resources OR… possibly simply being contained.

The causes, motives, purposes, etc., could be… many.

You could even have multiple third parties holding “the keys” to the whole… system.

By using humanity’s own consent, through subtle manipulations, ways, indoctrination and through less subtle ways, souls might simply relinquish their own power and suzerainty to… “Faith, Nature, Science, Gods, Higher Selves, Higher Truths, Higher Realities, Higher Ways, Sacred Words and Scriptures, … Etc.”

ANYTHING could be a manipulation or used as a manipulative tool for… whatever purpose.

These sorts of ideas are intriguing: you’re open to the idea that maybe just maybe…
It’s all a lie.
Even what we hold most dear," the ultimate truths of our existance"…

Disclaimer:

Again, threat these as thought provoking ideas…

If we can NOT question something, then we’re already slaves to that something.

Religions, Systems, Science, Methods, Dogmas, Spirituality, Higher Knowledge, Philosophies, EXPERIENCES… All can be and should be… Questioned.

Have a nice day. :pray:
Always question everything,
YET, do not ever rush to conclude anything.

Let’s flip the whole narrative on its head…

Even if spirituality, ultimately, would technically be a lie (judged from a higher pov), would it be a lie or a bad thing for the individual though?

Let’s take a video game, a show, a movie, a novel or anyway a fictious book: it can help you even if technically it’s an invention, even if it’s fiction…

If it can raise your mood, give you hope, entertain you, inspire you, then it’s not something unreal for you, rather it’s a helpful experience…

Therefore, even using such a simple example, we can conclude that something which ultimately might not be true, still holds some truth or can provide help to someone, therefore can be good…

In Nature there is not a single universal good: take the sun, there are individuals who are allergic to sunrays…

Again, the value of something can be given by what it provides for someone, if it helps you, it is or it might be good for you…

Disclaimer: I’m playing the role of the skeptic, cynical person or perhaps the fool, in these last few posts, and not only.

My view is that all views should be questioned, no doctrine should remain unchallenged, no truth should be untouchable…

It’s above all an exercise in thinking, perhaps not critical thinking, just thinking…
And an exercise of imagination.

Hmmm
I mean the best prison would be the one where you don’t notice you are in prison. A good example of this is the classic work life. But it’s not a very good prison if true, because resource allocation is clearly not assigned well and lacks efficiency.

Let’s hypothesize then that spirituality is a lie and it is intentionally designed a prison, well that looks like a great prison to me then because you upgrade literally on all fronts (mentally, emotionally, physically).

An example of this prison then, continuing with the hypothesis, is love. Let’s say love is a tool for manipulation. But how is this conceivable? An energy harvest? Real love radiates incredibly. But then what’s this energy used for? Negative entities dissolve and positive entities don’t require it. So is it for universe to grow?

Let’s continue then, if the noble truths are all wrong and a lie, it begs the question, what is true then?

And this is not easy to answer, because such prison guards would have evil intent while all inmates slowly upgrade on all levels, eventually the prison would collapse. But then the prison guards are actually noble in doing so.

In the end you’re going in circles.

I guess that’s free will then. To always have the choice to make such assumptions and interpretations. To have doubt and be able to raise questions. That might be the ultimate power.

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Thank You for the Reply. :pray:

I wanted to give a long reply, heck I even typed a lot of stuff, but then I realized that all those points could be themselves attacked, or viewed as flawed, and indeed, I have my limits lol.

Well,in my defense, it’s not necessarily my main thought process, therefore I do not need to defend the argument, yet it was or is an idea which sometimes goes through my head…

Indeed, the guards would have to be on the same team lol (as the controllers), and I think IF Earth (let’s not say the entire universe, since it just overcomplicates things) would be a closed or controlled system, indeed that would be the case…

Honestly, regarding the research, I can only provide regressive hypnosis (like the one I mentioned in some previous posts, Grifasi method) and some other techniques which point towards a higher scheme going on.

Again, there are researchers who simply take note of interference taking place in the subtle realms, like Calogero, without necessarily denying all Spirituality, but indeed, one kinda reaches the conclusion that humanity is highly manipulated and religion and spirituality are clearly infiltrated if not directly hijacked…

Again, I’ve so seen many positive ndes and indeed the vast majority of research points towards a positive universe, a positive life after life, to use some of Moody’s words…

It’s just that some research overwhelmingly points towards negative scenarios, lots of manipulations, negative entities taking advantage of people’s weaknesses or beliefs, etc., basically lying and manipulating many souls.

However, apparently even some of those researchers who have found apparent data which points towards some bad things, still point towards an infinite universe (well large enough), possibly filled with much more positivity than negativity, and ultimately even presents the “duping” (like manipulating people to reincarnate) as either a temporary thing (souls do indeed evolve and sooner or later will outgrow their controllers) or even actually an agreement made at a Higher Self level, again for experience or growth, as the background cause for reincarnation…

So, actually it’s a sort of agreement apparently, at least at a higher level, although Idk if for all souls or cases Idk.

Again, multiple researching methods points towards multiple possibilities…

Still, They overlap: afterlife is not denied, there is clearly an afterlife, we’re non material beings or whatever we are, we can Evolve, there is reincarnation, etc.

However, the rest of the data displays multiple possible models, with some of them pointing towards earth being a possibly prison planet, etc.

Again, Calogero, the guy who has researched hundreds of individuals if not more, using regressive hypnosis, has always said that his data is not truth, just data, Also he said that it’s polluted by how the subconscious interprets or translates the data, as information is collected and finally offered in some sessions, many published on yt, etc.

Still, if countless people see reptile like beings appearing as relatives at first, or as guides, then through certain techniques, like Etheric dna reading, they are reveleas to be manipulative beings, it makes you question the afterlife narrative lol…

And the data kinda clashes: people report highly positive experiences (near Death experiencers), yet those who tried Calogero s method report something else: manipulation (not necessarily that it’s a bad place, the afterlife, just that it’s a controlled environment, organized by non human entities (ets (and of all kind) and other beings), at least up to a point…

That method points towards vast realms and places which operate DIFFERENTLY, entirely differently, where Love, Light, etc. is not simulated or faked, rather the real deal.
Some were on the astral levels (and other levels Idk) of other planets, other pure places in entirely different dimensions or realities, etc.
Vaikunta Lokha or other high places from spirituality come to mind. :grin:
Interesting data i would say.

So, basically analyzing these sorts of data, techniques, etc. made me question spirituality further.

The thing is this: my own experience with spirituality has been highly positive lol, for the most part, minus having a few dark experiences, like when I was 5 years old and I saw myself floating from my bed towards an ugly looking entity/being etc.

Overall, a positive earthly experience and I would not rate spirituality as something negative.

However, I do think that manipulation of some sorts can indeed take place, although it’s hard to say how much of spirituality is corrupted.

It might be the minds of people being corrupted, not even spirituality lol.

At the end of the day, I will evolve and figure things out and so will You and Everyone, sooner or later lol.

Wether a controlled matrix or the most positive and genuine reality, or a mix lol, we’ll find out…

It might take aeons for some of us OR using fields and upgrading ourselves it should greatly speed up our evolution etc.

At the end of the day or eternity, lol (to put it like that), we’ll all evolve towards the highest versions possible of ourselves lol.

No worries, whatever the ultimate truth is…
We’ll find it lol.

If spirituality is getting on a path, then it is a lie.

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We are here with an outer world to create good experiences, which we do, but we also inadvertently create bad experiences, this is duality, creating only from within is non duality.

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Thank You for the Reply.

Why would creating from within be non-duality and from without duality?

From within we are fully aware of all creations.

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It humbles me to think how many people, individuals, countless souls I’ve had relationships with or met across aeons and aeons of life, lives, etc., how many experiences forgotten, how many beautiful souls who loved me or still love me, if all things are happening at once (in some ways or all ways Idk), from a higher point of view…

Also, how many moms, dads, brothers, sisters, lovers, families, lovely pets and friends, guides, souls who have helped me and souls whom I have helped…

It’s overwhelming how many connections me, you and everyone had, has/have and will have across oceans of time, space and other dimensions and ways to measure or scale life…

That’s WHY the more people you love, the more souls you love ideally unconditional, the closer you are to them, in some ways…
They are, were or will have some interactions with you or your dear ones and even if you do not interact, I think all life is interconnected anyway…

Judging from a higher point of view we’re all connected, one whole…
Therefore loving others is the way forward or one of the if not the most noblest of paths…

Accepting life, others and the Multiverse, the Divine within and without, etc. is the most comprehensive path or one of them anyways.

That old lady you saw near your local drug store, crossing the street?

She was or might have been a dear soul for you in another time and place…

Same for all beings, small and big.

I will focus on my growth and ending this thread.
Also, focusing on healing and on my evolution…

This thread serves no further purpose for me.

If you’ve read anything here or my thoughts across this forum, thank you.

Choose love, my friends, it’s the only truth…

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As time and life moves on, so must I end some cycles and start new ones…

This thread and other threads where I have asked countless questions will be closed, if the moderators agree.

For now only this one though lol…

I have 200 + threads, too much work for you guys, plus some I might leave open, even if I am ending my string of questions…

Practice is higher than questioning, and unconditional love towards all life, beings, towards the whole, all worlds, etc. is the highest human and non human peak, in my view.

Thank You, My Friends for answering so many of my questions, also for your immeasurable help sent to me and my family across the years.

Take care, I Love You.

I will stay on the forum lol, just less interactive as before.

@moderators, can you please lock this thread?
Thank You.

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