Diksha necessary? (Kālī Mantra's and Kālī worship discussion...)

General Discussion
24

Hello,
What is fact when it comes to yawning during mantra chant?

Is it okay?
What to do when this happens?

I read the following saying that it’s not good essentially …:

Alright. Here is to sharing another knowledge base from Ashram Culture - and this time on Yawning !

We see people Yawn at anytime of the day. To most, it is normal and natural, both. A person yawning is assumed to have not slept in peace the night before or is feeling exhausted and fatigued. It is not considered very social and generally considered as bad manners. Medical science finds a low oxygen level in the body to be the underlying cause of this. Combining this with heaviness of eyes would mean the person is feeling sleepy.

Yawning is not fine as per Ashram Culture. It is considered an illness that needs a Vaid. Whenever my Guru Acharya Amarnath ji would notice anyone Yawning in the Ashram, he would immediately send the person for physical labor; be it gardening, picking wood from trees, washing clothes, cleaning up rooms etc so that he may exert physically. This would be followed by meal just before Sunset and warm milk with dry fruits + cow ghee. Disciples fatigued due to lengthy pooja were handled differently.

As per Ayurveda and ancient Hindu wisdom, Yawning is considered a degenerative disease.

Many people today, take doziness during Pujan or Mantra Chant as some celestial trance or spell of the Deity. Allowing or even encouraging dozing at times. In reality, it is never like this. One should know, essentially, that the moment a person Chanting mantra or performing Pujan of any kind, begins to doze, instantly, Pujan of the Deity (for whom the person is sitting) stops and another subtle entity takes over. This is considered a vighn or impediment in the process. This doziness must be avoided.

Additionally, this feeling of drowsiness must be shared with the Guru instantly. A Siddh, competent or Learned Guru will immediately ask, check, verify and resolve this problem.

This happened with me. I was performing SriVidya Pujan those days. I have never seen a more elaborate a Pujan than this. My Guru Amarnath ji came to know of me yawning during Mantra Chant. He called me up and inquired about the whole process I was following, in full detail. In fact, even before I could share the details with him, he announced that I was leaving some essential part of the Pujan. Whereas, on my part, I felt myself to be complying with the procedure fully. For my obstinacy on the procedure, I was shunted out of the Ashram.

(It was much later that I realized my shortcoming, repented over my action, carried out all prayashchit as per directions of my Guru, including going without food for days, tonsuring head – in spite of me being a grown up and in Business - And finally found my way back into the Ashram with double the dignity).

But what I learnt from the incident was a very critical point. That when the procedure is faulty and the Deity is not satisfied by the performance, vighn or impediments of various kind begin to appear. Yawning is one such impediment.

A person who undertakes Sadhna of any kind, must pray to his Isht, Bhagwan Ganpati as VighnHarta and perform Bhoot Shuddhi (for Sadhna related to Bhagwan Shiv or Ma Durga, including all Their forms) and Vishnu SahastraNaam (for Sadhna related to Bhagwan Vishnu and all His forms), as a precaution against impediments.

This has now been confirmed to me through Yog Sadhna, which I follow for over a decade now. This information is not something available on any website or scriptures. It is shared here specifically to help others excel in their quest for Spirituality

@Maoshan_Wanderer
I know you don’t really post any more bro…

But maybe one day you’ll see this and would like to reply, so I @ you… :pray:

There seems to be those who think it’s okay and those who think it’s not…

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25

not Maoshan, but yawning , especially in a spiritual practice context, means that a powerful method unclogs the energetic channels, reestablishing the normal flow of energies in parts of our subtle energy bodies. And this can also be observed with certain very effective fields, especially when we listen to them for the first time and they perform the first unclogging of the blockages unworked on till then.

That may appear different from yawning out of boredom, but what is boredom other than a state of being “fed up” with something, being it inactivity, or lack of stimulation of our emotional / astral body etc

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26

Hi thanks for responding ! Yeah I knew this and the gathering of prana during yawning but in the context of worship I wanted to know what is correct in Saddhana … it seems some Gurus think it’s not a correct thing

And if I should stop the chant if I’m in mid yawn or continue it if I feel I can enunciate correctly while trying to stop the yawn, and if it’s disrespectful to even continue the chant amidst a yawn

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27

I think you are a respectful and devotional person, doing it the best you can. If you are in the presence of a guru when chanting then be concerned about his/her rules on yawning. Most people just consider it a release of energy or shifting/clearing = a good thing. I think you can just let it happen, let it go and move on (like what if you had passed gas :joy:). As long as you are doing this on your own, try to be moderate/balanced about it - not fanatical. :pray:

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28

This is also something that I have been wanting to ask about haha…

I get in my mind about these things quite often

I always try to nullify it super hard lol

I dunno when this will happen, one day I suppose…

I also know there’s so much more things I can be doing

Which I think about too…

When I get financially secured i want to do food offerings

And I wonder what to do with the food afterwards…
Some say it’s okay to eat it or to give it away
But then others say what’s the point of eating it

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30

Thank you for sharing!

I used to yawn a lot during meditation and entering theta or right before Delta (in Delta I would be like in a sea of nothingness unaware of my presence and time, no yawning would happen for me then)

Figured it was just energy blockage releases

I started meditating again recently, doesn’t really happen any more to me I don’t think

Only while chanting :face_exhaling:

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31

i don’t think yawning is a disrespectful thing to the deity, as it’s a natural process; deities don’t have a human ego, they live in highly blissful states always, and their feelings about this may be what we feel when we see a sleepy kitten yawning, who can think about disrespect when seeing such a vulnerable creature :) We cuddle and hug the kitten and help it grow and become what it’s natural for him to become :cat2:

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32

Well, it’s said that pronunciation is highly important when chanting… especially the names of a deity…

And I’ve heard of many stories of Ill effects from non initiated practices or incorrect pronunciation for example…

If I yawn, should I restart the repetition of the mantra?
Is it bad to continue if I “believe” I can do it correctly through the yawn while trying to get rid of the yawn?

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33

Also, if I stop a chant mid way due to a sneeze cough yawn etc

Should I restart from the beginning (beginning of the count, 1/108)?

Or just restart that single repetition and continue counting

How long should I wait before I restart the repetition/count? I assume not immediately but similar to however long there’s silence typically between chant repetitions?

34

i wouldn’t restart from the beginning, it’s not a punishment :)
Just do what you feel to do in that situation and don’t let this worry you, the mental state and emotional state are what’s important, the purpose of the method is to help you reach a certain state, that will eventually become permanent, through repetition

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35

Restarting from the beginning isn’t a punishment though, I don’t view it that way

I mean like, it would mean for a more flawless 108 chants no?

More aligned to the resonance of a perfect practice, more connected to it’s pure energies?
I think at least

36

when you do it with all your heart, like you, with elan and ardor, then more repetitions bring more bliss and faster results, this is the path of vira, the path of the spiritual hero, where the engine is his strong desire and aspiration, ( oposed to the path of somebody who was just born in a certain culture and religion and was told that he has to do it, but he doesn’t feel the urge yet)

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37

Ahhhh you make me feel like I should be doing more chanting now :laughing:

Thank you for your kind words and wisdom!

Shoot, maybe I should double up lol…

Actually, I will try!

I won’t commit to double daily with promise… But I will try to do double frequently

There’s nothing hindering me from doing double the amount of chants, so why shouldn’t I?

Thank you! :)

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38

Summary

Important don’ts —

One should not chant on the mālā

while walking or in a vehicle
while talking
with the head covered
while wearing shoes
in public
when unclean
in an unclean place
too fast or too slow
while laughing
while looking around here and there
with a mind disturbed by hunger, worry, anger etc.
while lying down
when not properly seated
with legs stretched
in darkness
The above prohibitions do not apply to mantra chanted in the mind without the mālā.

The mālā should not be

carried in public
displayed
touched with the forefinger while chanting
shaken
dropped
touched with the left hand
Important do’s —

One should do japa

according to one’s capacity
daily
without missing a day
with a fixed number of mantras from day to day, neither more nor less
in a concealed or private manner
There are three types of japa

vācika – when the mantra is uttered clearly
upāṁśu – when the mantra is chanted softly so that it can only be heard by the chanter
mānasa – when the mantra is chanted purely in the mind moving from one letter to another and one word to another
Of these, mānasa japa is the best, followed by upāṁśu, and then by vācika.

I suppose, fasting and hunger are 2 different things… Which is why the Hari Bhakti Vilasa says one shouldn’t do japa with a mind disturbed by hunger?

I suppose with a disturbed mind from hunger, one would need to do more Haṭhayōga to train the body and Rājayōga for the mind?..

Chanting in mind is okay to do anywhere (lying down, in impure places etc) but not out loud with mālā is also said (stating to give additional context to the summary)

39

Hey Crystal!
I just found out today that

Om

is a Bija mantra

So any mantra containing it would need Diksha too?

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40

So many different views/rules in different Sampradayas…

I just read this for example:

From what I understand, the pranavam or onkaram is a secret that reveals itself to those who meditate upon it. Therefore, you can visualise it, listen to it, and gently hum/breathe the term “um” to mimic the sound you’re listening to as you meditate.

Mantras generally require some manner of instruction therefore it has been recommended to me to always get some form of instruction prior to chanting them. You don’t need instruction to listen or meditate upon them, though.

If you are a layperson, learning bhajans/strotras, visualising their meaning as you say them is a big deal.

For instance, if you wish to meditate upon the names/qualities of the Lord Shiva, look up the sahasranamam and learn the person who said it, the context behind how it is said, as well as the meaning of each name. If you wish to praise him, sing the Shiva tandava strotra as you visualise Ravana, a knowledgeable devote of Lord Shiva climbing the Kailasa mountain with a veena, singing to the dancing Lord. Similarly, read the puranas and meditate upon what they say; these are also texts that you can pursue without a formal guru.

Doing rituals that bring a lot of meaning and joy to your practice is recommended over chanting a mantra that may be a little beyond what you have learned in your journey.

Also, just an additional note: understand that it is a dosha to repeat the same thing twice, therefore names that are repeated within the sahasranamam have different meanings depending on how they were arranged; find good sources that give the right translation that you are looking for. Having a good teacher is great here but learning what you can, on your own with good sources is also completely acceptable.

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