Is it YOUR BODY? What or who is You? Self and Environment

General Discussion
#1

I really like the Buddhist notion of “not self”, although I’ll only mention it, since I’m not really that informed about Buddhist, Hinduism or any of their doctrines (read a few articles, watched a few videos, beginner stuff); what does “Self” and “Non-Self” mean to you?

What is self?

If you go by materialist(ic) ideas, it’s the/your body, yet something is missing, we can do things that far transcend the physical body;
And let’s think about it: the skin (and all the cells) that you shed, are they self or no(t) self?
The air in your lungs? How about before you inhale, is the air yours? Is it self, non-self?
Your thoughts? Are they truly yours?
Your genes? Creations of your parents, they got them from their parents,…, going all the way back to God knows when (a point when genes appeared).
Etc.

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#2

You are pure consciousness.

Consciousness that observes and creates everything else.

Therefore, everything else (thoughts, energy, matter, information, emotions, personality traits etc.) is artificial and not “you”.

But also keep in mind that you as a consciousness are much bigger than just the part that you are currently aware of. For example, most people are not aware that they also have a Subconscious Mind, a Higher Self, other parallel selves etc.

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#3

The only thing that I truly have a hard time understanding are these type of notions; is reaching a higher/enlightened state the only way to experience pure consciousness or I am already experiencing it? :sweat_smile:

Is it the “witness” which yogi talk about (at least the closest or the easieast part of our True Self) - so, not the thoughts, the atoms, etc., but Pure Consciousness, yet how to “define” it?

#4

Everything is IS. That is the eternal identity. Of being itself. This body/life is a spark in a fire, or a drop in the ocean (or the ocean in a drop).

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#5

I have found concepts that bring some sort of “separation” do not really reflect the most enlightened state to me

To a degree, my mind is much able to hold opposites at the same time… Or a blend of the two…

So that’s what I go by…

You only need to ‘realize’ that you are Pure Consciousness

But at the same time, You must be able to see a certain topic both on the scale of the grand scheme of things, and on the immediate scheme as well.

Meaning, your body is not ‘yours’ in the very grand scheme of things

But it is also fully yours, in this very moment… You take care of it. You nourish it.

It is one vessel out of many for your beingness.

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#6

From our 3d human perspective I think the best way to try to understand consciousnesss is by defining everything that it is not.

If something is observable, then you are the observer and hence that thing that you observe is not you and actual consciousness.

If something is createable / manifestable, then you are the creator and hence that thing that you are creating is not you and actual consciousness.

Consciousness (a.k.a. you) grows through the process of observation, creation and experience.
This is done with all the tools that can be observed, manifested and experienced (thoughts, energy, matter, information, emotions, personality traits, beliefs, morphic fields etc.).

The more aspects of creation you are aware of, the larger you are as a consciousness.

The source, who is aware of everything, has the largest consciousness.

We as consciousness fragments are only aware of a part of everything, and hence experience ourselves as separate and as “still growing”.

It is difficult for me to put these concepts into 3D physical brain symbols (words), so please forgive me if this is not fully clear in the way how I wrote it.

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#7

Thank you so much for your answers. :pray:

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#8

The whole course of time is the blink of an eye - thats a quote from a song

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#9

What song?

#10

All of the energy in life
Is nothing more than a spark in a fire
The whole course of time is the blink of an eye

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#11

According to lacanian psychoanalisis (not Freud, Jung, Klein or Adler and Sartre) essence, substance and identity are illusory ways in which we relate to radical otherness.

We are a void that lacks essence or substance and due to its capacity to split and fragment itself we become unconscious and we become divided/separated but also engaged with the reality that is created passively through us for the emergence of meaning and existences.

Lacan even postulates that any form of meaning has a religious structure.

In this sense, we are fundamentally broken, but we can also do something about it by learning to realize our void and lack of meaning we become less parasited by the unconscious and otherness/self illussions.

This also resembles many teachings from Zen buddhism.

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#12

It does; although I’m not really knoledgeable in anything, I know few notions here and there and I actually thought that it resembles some Buddhist teachings (I’m not familiar with Zen, have not studied about it yet), before reaching the quoted part.

Well, Lacan may be right (maybe or even probably), yet, for my personal perception, I Need Meaning; whether our perceptions are illusory or not, in the end (at least now, at this stage in our Evolution), we need them, we need this comfort, real or otherwise.

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#13

Yeah, without ego we are just vegetables.

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#14

Do you guys ever wonder “Why am I me and not you?” As an adult this question still plagues me. Like if we are all one then what makes me this specific focal point of the one? :sob:

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Last Big Questions for 2022? - God's Goals, Monism, Infinite Journey/Evolution
Last Big Questions for 2022? - God's Goals, Monism, Infinite Journey/Evolution
#15

Disclaimer: For discussion’s sake, the following post is what the Theravada Buddhist view is on non-self, I thought I would mention and discuss it since it is mentioned in the first post of the topic.

In the topic title you say: “What or who is You?” This questions implies that there is a self, a permanent essence somewhere to be found within your mind and/or body. A better question to ask is “What do I take my self to be?”, because this leaves open the possibility that there is no self, no permanent essence to be found.

Since you mentioned Buddhism and non-self, I thought I would mention what Theravada Buddhism mentions about it. In Theravada Buddhism, there are these five components of existence.

Body or Form
Feelings or Experience
Perceptions
Mental formations like thoughts and the will
Consciousnesses (Yes, 6 different types - smell, taste, touch, hearing, seeing and mind consciousness (aka knowing, the knower))

Again, according to Theravada Buddhism, Each one of these components of existence is said to be non-self, impermanent. There is nothing outside these five components of existence.

If any of these components of existence were permanent or a self you would be able to control them, and they would be permanent.

If body was self or permanent you would never get sick or age, but the body is always changing, aging and so on, getting sick. You would be able to say “may my body never get sick or age”, if it were self or permanent, but that is not possible.

If feelings were self or permanent, you could say “may I only feel happy feelings and never negative feelings”, but that is not the case in life, you cannot really control your feelings to that extent.

Perceptions are different for everyone, one day you may perceive something in one way, then years later in a different way, so it is not fixed and permanent, not-self.

Mental formations including thoughts and the will are not self or permanent, they are always changing. The will is conditioned by your past experiences and knowledge, thoughts as well, and one does not think all the time, there are gaps between thoughts or when meditating soemtimes. The will is not always there, it is changing, sometimes it is strong, sometimes weak.

Consciousnesses, the 6 different types of consciousness, are not permanent or self, including mind consciousness itself. You see something then you become aware of seeing, you hear something then you are aware of hearing, mind consciousness is arising and passing away, it is not always there, it is not constant, it does not last forever. It is difficult to see clearly because the mind is very quick, there are so many processes going on per second. Anyway another point is that you can never know for certain that something is eternal, so if mind consciousness was eternal, you would never know for sure, eternity being an infinite amount of time.

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