Isn’t the origin of servitors traced back to Chaos Magic?
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No idea
Who needs servitors when you have IPF lol.
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I feel really sorry for those who practice it for 10-15 years while we get that so easy. Life’s not fair to all. 
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If you ask me most of us shouldn’t even be on earth to begin with.
We deserve alot more than you think.
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As I said, life’s not fair to all.
But whatever. Why to be frustrated with something I have no control over?
I’m pretty sure I read, I believe on this forum, that Chaos Magick is the same thing as Manifestation/Law of Attraction. Do you disagree with that idea @NobleLight?
EDIT: Found it:
This is where Chaos Magick gets tricky and abstract, especially regarding definitions. Lets start with how you define “Manifestation”. I define manifestation as “Bringing into existence”. So, to me, manifestation is a concept. For example, “I manifested a new car”. This could be through using money, the lotto, instant materialization etc.
Chaos Magick on the other hand, is what I view to be more of a system in which you use belief as a tool to produce change in you reality that conforms with your will. For example, lets say you want to manifest a car. It is possible that in my system of Chaos magic, I may choose to use sigil magic to charge a sigil that will allow my car to manifest into my life.
So I dont think you can call Chaos Magick equivalent to Manifestation, because they are 2 different concepts. You can say that Chaos Magick is a system to manifest your desires.
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I am reading that book you linked, thanks for that. But, I was curious to your thoughts as well.
Sure, no problem. It can be hard to explain what Chaos Magick “Is” because it almost goes against the definition of Chaos Magic. The best way to put it is, Chaos Magick is what you choose it is. We could both practice Magick, yet I could do it through the use of a scientific aesthetic and another could use it through the aesthetic of praising satan. This doesnt make one “wrong” because there is no “wrong” because there is no absolute truth. It’s a tricky concept to wrap your head around.
To answer the question above simply regarding Chaos Magick vs Manifestation I would say
Manifestation is a verb/noun used to describe something coming into existence
Chaos Magick is a system in which you use belief as a tool to influence your reality conforming with your will.
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Thanks for the recommendation!
I was eyeing chaos magic for some time but then rather leaned towards Franz Bardon’s work.
Isn’t it the chaos magic guys who say magic is about intent + tweaking probabilities? E.g. “it is hard to win the lottery because even if you can multiply your chances 100 times through magic, it is still extremely low” and “your intention is going against a lot of other people’s intention, and a lot of people intent to win passionately”.
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Sure, I love sharing knowledge and this is such an interesting subject.
I’m not sure which guys your referring too but I can kind of see what you mean. A lot of magick in general is based on first having a desire and then building and intent and then through whatever magical means producing a desired result. I’m sure some magick systems use probabilities in their system but I don’t believe that it is an inherent aspect of Chaos Magick.
Since a central theme of Chaos Magick is there is no absolute truth, the only limitations upon the practitioners are the ones imposed on themselves by their system of beliefs.
So for your example of winning the lottery, it is just as plausible for a practitioner of Chaos Magic to believe “I desire to win the lottery. Because I am the creator of my reality and everything is energy, I can choose the lottery as a means to provide me abundance. I have a strong belief in sigil magic so all I have to do is make a sigil stating me desire, charge it, and leave it to the forces of the universe. Soon without a doubt I will win a lottery in some way shape or form”
also to answer an earlier question, Servitors are considered to be a branch of Chaos Magick. Austin Osman Spare stated first stated that the psychological complexes theorized by Carl Jung could be deliberately created through a sigil technique
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Interesting, haven’t heard this before. I like this kind of history.
I got something good for you, took me a little digging. If you search “austin osman spare” “sentient sigils” (with quotations) you can find a link to a pdf with massive library of essays on Austin Osman Spare. I didnt link it because you need to do click on it from google.
Here is a brief excerpt I found
“Spare’s system of Sentient Sigils explained below. Sleep should be preceded by some form of Karezza during which a specially chosen sigil symbolizing the desired object is vividly visualized. In this manner the libido is baulked of its natural fantasies and seeks satisfaction in the dream world. When the knack is acquired the dream will be extremely intense and dominated by a succube, or shadow-woman, with whom sexual intercourse occurs spontaneously. If the dreamer has aquired even a moderate degree of proficiency in this technique he will be aware of the continued presence of the sigil. This he should bind upon the form of the succube in a place that is within range of his vision during copulation, e.g., as a pendant suspended from her neck; as ear-drops; or as the diadem in a circlet about her brow…”
“presence of the Shadow-Woman will be experienced with a vivid intensity of sensation and clarity of vision. The sigil thus becomes sentient and in due course the object of the Working materializes on the physical plane. This object is, of course, determined by the desire embodied in and represented by the sigil”
Depending on how you define servitor this might be the earliest mention I have found of summoning a psychological complex through use of sigil magic. It’s possible he expands on this idea in some of his books
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LOL, okay so the idea of a “sexy-time” servitor is kinda hilarious. I know that’s not what was meant by the text above, but still it made me laugh.
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haha, I thought it was funny too because someone a while ago was asking about sex related to servitors. This is interesting because he talks about it manifesting it in the dream world by visualizing a sigil created in the waking world. I definitely plan to read some of Spare’s books, hopefully we can unearth some more interesting information.
Imo this feels like a backward step. I remember reading a post by @_OM on how on the old XM forums there were magick practitioners who still produced inconsistent results. Morphic fields apparently outdid them. So why take a step into ‘old methods’? Kind of strange if you ask me.
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Well… to experiment? I mean, why not? I don’t listen to any other channel to be honest, no other creators/subs etc.
However a couple of months ago I felt stuck and like nothing was going my way, and I did a little sympathetic magic ritual before going to bed one day.
I used 2 cups, one representing current situation (=despair) and the other the desired outcome (=feeling whole). The ritual is you put water in the first glass, meditate over it and decide that’s what the glass represents.
Then you meditate over the other glass and decide what that represents.
Then you pour the water into the second one and drink it (keeping firm in your mind you are becoming one with what it represents).
Within 2 days I accidentally stumbled across sapien med channel.
Coincidence?
Maybe 
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Don’t put limits on yourself. Altrough Dream is my number one i still use some other methods like sigils, psionic, radionics etc. Try it, it works.
Sure, morphogenic fields are helpful and all, but you arent going to change your life just by listening to some music. You need action as well. And it is not like one thing is best for everyone. I feel people are having a really hard time understanding what having “No absolute truth” means. This means there is “No Definitive answer” there is no one truth that is true for all. Just because you read about some people talking poorly about chaos magick does not mean it is not a reliable or consistent school of thought.
If you cant grapple the concept of Chaos Magick then dont bother with it. It just feels silly to me to say “This subject is better in every way so now this subject is use less”. First off, this isnt even an accurate statement, and second off, what about all the people who have no benefit from these Morphogenic fields? Should they just give up trying new things?
I ask these question because it feels like you are coming from a very limited mindset. Not to mention these are two completely different concepts. Is meditating useless to you since there are audios now? Have you given up on mindfulness? If you have not had personal experience with chaos magick then I dont think it is fair to even begin to try to objectively asses its reliable (which is impossible to do because it is subjective to each and every practitioner)
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I apologise because I’ve clearly raised a sensitive and controversial opinion. It was not my wish to rile anyone up. It is just a personal opinion, you guys do your thing, I have no wish to convince anyone of my opinion. Besides, it was just something I heard on this forum.
I did magick in many forms in the past, close to about 8 years ago now, chaos magick included. Did energy work and meditation for about 12 years too. I just said whatever I had in mind. I mean, if you can find a consistent implementation of magick I’d be completely down to learn too.
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